Incident Postmortem and Updates on Reliability

[nocodejordan]

@allenyang

Over time we’re trying out different ways of getting features tested. We have tried flavors of running alphas or closed betas or experimental features. A challenge with these approaches we’ve had is that either not enough users use alternate environments seriously enough, and/or it’s tough to work on their production apps. That means the testing is much more limited. Often the majority of bugs deal with more poweruser use cases. We’re continuing to try different ideas here though!

How about just launching it to free users first? Would that increase the population to a suitable number? Another suggestion would be to batch content/breaking updates on a regular schedule, so that users know what to expect.

As it is now, it feels like updates are just pushed out randomly, often giving Bubblers heart attacks in the middle of the night.

Surprises definitely do not come welcome when you are launching updates with no heads up to production-ready apps.

For the benefit of the community, I am also bringing up this page for visibility : Releases | Bubble Wondering if Bubblers would like the ability to subscribe to notifications for major updates.

[mghatiya]

@allenyang

The tradeoff is that these projects mean we will have less bandwidth for other work, such as user-facing features.

I wonder what would this mean. Would be good to know what is getting compromised here. For example if stuff to be built to improve WU usage and tracking gets affected with this, then the pricing update date should be postponed.

Some stuff like version control have been released really half baked and we don’t hear anything after that on those. Version control in its current shape has added almost no value to me. I even now copy-paste from one version to another as version control doesn’t allow to see differences and to merge selectively. This is just an example of the issues.

So I am curious to know what is going to get impacted with the focus on performance and stability (Though I agree it is high time stability is given a priority).

[allenyang]

@chaostorm

@josh @allenyang Would it be possible to bundle any updates to the editor with regular engine version updates that are opt-in upgrades through Settings? I feel like that should make most of the problems we’ve been seeing lately more manageable on our side as Bubble users.

Yep, this is a possibility we’ve talked about. Something like this is likely the direction we want to go for the future. In the short term though, it’d be a significant change (ie large project), and we’re not entirely sure that it would actually solve more problems than it would create (ie it creates new types of risks and potential problems).

@nocodejordan

How about just launching it to free users first? Would that increase the population to a suitable number?

We’ve thought about this too - and it’s sort of what the distinction between Immediate and Scheduled Release tiers results in. Just launching to Free users does not seem to be the most effective in terms of getting a) a lot of usage and, crucially, reliable feedback when things are wrong, or b) a lot of usage on more complex apps and poweruser use cases, which in practice is where a lot of bugs pop up.

@mghatiya

I wonder what would this mean. Would be good to know what is getting compromised here.

It’s primarily new features in the editor or the Bubble language that would be slowed down. We do have a separate pod - which won’t have their roadmap as filled with tech debt - that’s working on pricing-related topics like workload and the UX around that.

[Frinet]

Thanks a million for sharing this! Your insights are always a valuable addition to the discussion.

As for the eternal question of “When will the dark theme be available?” It’s like waiting for the day when code will write itself – a dream we all secretly hope for! But until then, let’s keep our fingers crossed and our screens well-lit as we navigate through the Bubble magic!

[scriptschool]

It’s Time For The Bubble Leadership To Step Aside

This message is harsh, but I believe it needs to be said.

We’ve received many messages like this from you in the past, and it’s no longer sufficient. For instance, the transition away from CoffeeScript dominated discussions for months and was pinpointed as a cause for delayed features. The emphasis on ‘Automated Testing’ was promoted as a priority, promising earlier detection of bugs and prevention of faulty code rollouts. Now we hear that the testing was less than optimal and requires enhancements, leading to yet more delays in feature rollouts?!

These frequent outages are the norm with the Bubble platform, and have been for years. Also routine is delayed feature development, for the elusive goal of platform stability which never comes. Essential (and basic) features, such as the table element, are long-awaited, for years. These features are advertised as ‘coming soon’, but when they do finally arrive, they fall well short of their intended functionality and user expectations (sometimes so much so as to be dead on arrival).

Features aren’t arriving. Platform stability remains elusive. The user base ranges from disgruntled to outright revolt.

Bubble leadership, you started with a revolutionary product that earned widespread admiration. You built a platform that people wanted to love. However, it’s become evident that the management of these fundamental issues, not to mention the repeated changes in pricing that have eroded our trust, is holding Bubble back.

It’s time to address the elephant in the room. While the Bubble leadership has pioneered an innovative, game-changing product, you appear to be unable to scale it (or manage it) effectively. There’s no shame in not being able to transition to scale, guys. You’re visionaries. You accomplished something amazing already. But now, you are holding Bubble back.

Perhaps it’s time for a change in leadership—a seasoned, experienced team that can elevate Bubble to its full potential.

Bubble’s potential is boundless. But it needs the right hands to unleash it.

Please, step aside for some seasoned, experienced leadership who can take this platform to the next level.

Sorry if this is harsh but enough is enough.

Best,
P

[salama]

@josh @allenyang

I’ve been closely following the recent updates and postmortems regarding the platform’s reliability and future plans. While I appreciate the transparency and the steps being taken to improve, I have some concerns I’d like to share:

1. Resource Allocation Post-Series A: Since the Series A funding round, it seems the focus has shifted more towards growth, marketing, and user acquisition. While these are important, it appears to have come at the expense of platform capability and developer UX. I worry that this could be a short-term gain but a long-term loss if the core product doesn’t meet user expectations.
2. User Feedback and Feature Requests: The ideas board is brimming with upvoted features that reflect the needs and wants of power users. However, the pace at which these features are being implemented suggests that the company’s priorities may be more aligned with investors than with the actual user base.
3. Evolution of Company Stage: Bubble is not the same company it was in its early days. With over 3 million users, the needs and feedback from this large user base should be a primary driver for product development. Holding onto old features, code, or beliefs about what Bubble needs could hinder progress and alienate users.
4. Competitive Positioning: Given the evolving landscape of no-code and low-code platforms, perhaps it’s time to slow down on growth and focus on making the platform more competitive. I would encourage you to look at what other market leaders like FlutterFlow and WebFlow are doing. Learning from competitors is not a sign of weakness but a strategic move to understand market demands better.

I believe that addressing these concerns can not only improve the platform but also build a more sustainable and user-centric growth model. Thank you for taking the time to read my thoughts, and I look forward to seeing how Bubble continues to evolve.

[psycholabdesign]

Thank you for your postmortem and response from the Product Team.

Can we expect an implementation of SLA down the line in maybe, just maybe near future (or some future) ?

[S2294]

@scriptschool

It’s Time For The Bubble Leadership To Step Aside

This message is harsh, but I believe it needs to be said.

We’ve received many messages like this from you in the past, and it’s no longer sufficient. For instance, the transition away from CoffeeScript dominated discussions for months and was pinpointed as a cause for delayed features. The emphasis on ‘Automated Testing’ was promoted as a priority, promising earlier detection of bugs and prevention of faulty code rollouts. Now we hear that the testing was less than optimal and requires enhancements, leading to yet more delays in feature rollouts?!

These frequent outages are the norm with the Bubble platform, and have been for years. Also routine is delayed feature development, for the elusive goal of platform stability which never comes. Essential (and basic) features, such as the table element, are long-awaited, for years. These features are advertised as ‘coming soon’, but when they do finally arrive, they fall well short of their intended functionality and user expectations (sometimes so much so as to be dead on arrival).

Features aren’t arriving. Platform stability remains elusive. The user base ranges from disgruntled to outright revolt.

Bubble leadership, you started with a revolutionary product that earned widespread admiration. You built a platform that people wanted to love. However, it’s become evident that the management of these fundamental issues, not to mention the repeated changes in pricing that have eroded our trust, is holding Bubble back.

It’s time to address the elephant in the room. While the Bubble leadership has pioneered an innovative, game-changing product, you appear to be unable to scale it (or manage it) effectively. There’s no shame in not being able to transition to scale, guys. You’re visionaries. You accomplished something amazing already. But now, you are holding Bubble back.

Perhaps it’s time for a change in leadership—a seasoned, experienced team that can elevate Bubble to its full potential.

Bubble’s potential is boundless. But it needs the right hands to unleash it.

Please, step aside for some seasoned, experienced leadership who can take this platform to the next level.

Sorry if this is harsh but enough is enough.

Amen to that @scriptschool . These have been my exact thoughts over the past couple of years.

I fail to see what is causing Bubble to crawl their way from one mess to another. They are not exactly building a spaceship. I mean, even Spacex fixes bugs faster than Bubble does.

The fact that even after 10 years the company has to put ‘brakes’ on a roadmap that is already years behind competition in terms of pace of development, is a cause for serious concern.

I love Bubble. But I don’t believe the product has the team it deserves.

[gaimed]

Such a ridicilous comment. There are enough no-code platforms out there. They are not able to complete with Bubble. So Bubble is doing something right. Everything has its pro’s and con’s. No need to get so personal. You always have the freedom to use something else.

[boston85719]

@allenyang

Over time we’re trying out different ways of getting features tested. We have tried flavors of running alphas or closed betas or experimental features. A challenge with these approaches we’ve had is that either not enough users use alternate environments seriously enough, and/or it’s tough to work on their production apps. That means the testing is much more limited. Often the majority of bugs deal with more poweruser use cases. We’re continuing to try different ideas here though!

I have an idea. Pay us. I’ll test out your new features and tell you everything that is great/terrible about them. I’m sure a lot of the other professional Bubble developers out there would take the time out of their busy schedules trying to earn a living to test out new features if it came with a financial incentive.

@scriptschool

It’s Time For The Bubble Leadership To Step Aside

I don’t think this is the issue. The problems arrived with the $100 million funding.

@salama

• Resource Allocation Post-Series A: Since the Series A funding round, it seems the focus has shifted more towards growth, marketing, and user acquisition. While these are important, it appears to have come at the expense of platform capability and developer UX. I worry that this could be a short-term gain but a long-term loss if the core product doesn’t meet user expectations.
• User Feedback and Feature Requests: The ideas board is brimming with upvoted features that reflect the needs and wants of power users. However, the pace at which these features are being implemented suggests that the company’s priorities may be more aligned with investors than with the actual user base.

Yes and Yes.

[scriptschool]

Yep. Bubble is indeed doing something right. And they are also doing lots of things wrong. Hence the criticism.

As for your suggestion I leave? Bizarre. It’s reasonable for a person to want to stay on a platform yet want change at the top, the bottom, or anywhere in between. Totally unreasonable to suggest people leave because they call for improvement.

Finally, you say ‘No need to get so personal.’ Interesting . Shall I note that you led off your comment with - quote - ‘such a ridiculous comment’ (and told me to leave)? So who’s getting personal then? (film projector - get it )

I’ll be calling it out as I see it. If you’re happy, good for you. I’m not. I think Bubble could be much, much more, and I believe the leadership needs to change (and I’ve believed this for some time). Hence the call for leadership change. Thanks for your contribution @gaimed.

Best,
P

[daxiacube]

The app is still lagging seriously. I haven’t been able to do much in a week. Dynamic data calls are still slow and Send Email body section doesn’t load at all for existing workflows…

Quite a lot of issues for over 9 days…

[mishav]

@daxiacube

Quite a lot of issues for over 9 days…

How do you feel about the main metric on the status page?

[davidscott.pal]

This graph even has bugs in it lol

[tylerboodman]

@davidscott.pal You must go a layer deeper

[gaimed]

downtime and issues are different things…

[daxiacube]

Here is the screenshot of the persisting issue

[boston85719]

@josh @allenyang

Please do not lose sight of the fact that a contributing factor to user exhaustion with the issues and bugs in the editor is the bug reporting process and the outcomes of those reports.

Often times Bugs that are actually bugs are claimed to be ‘intended behavior’. Even when you point out through logic and exemplify how the same function behaves differently in slightly different scenarios (think the conditional tab, clear the dynamic expression for property to change is datasource, deletes the property to change ( Watch Video Submitted ), but for a text property the clear dynamic expression does exactly what it should, which is simply clears the dynamic expression leaving the property to change in tact (Watch Video Submitted)).

Additionally, many times a bug is considered a bug, the response is that it will be fixed with an upcoming (no ETA provided) larger feature release, and will not be fixed in the interim. Or, we get a response that the bug can not be fixed, but get an untested/unverified workaround that fails to perform.

In the off chance that a bug is considered a bug and a fix will be put into place, most of the time the fix takes 14 - 30 days to be fixed.

I currently am dealing with an issue in a LIVE app that causes the SEO functions to not work properly (probably the fourth time reporting this issue within the last 3 years) and makes it so my pages are not indexed by Google (not my issue, but is a real Bug in Bubble that makes it so the content is not served up properly consistently, so the dynamic content of the page for some data entries is served up and is indexed, but not all, so, think a Blog with 100 articles, maybe 10 articles are indexable, but the other 90 are not because Bubble is not serving up the SEO data properly on a consistent basis).

When paying Bubble monthly subscription fees for live apps to try and operate a real business via Bubble built webapp, and the business like every single online business relies heavily on traffic, and the backbone of that traffic would be organic search traffic, it is well known that if you are not on the first page of Google, you don’t have a business, so if you are not even indexable by Google, you for sure don’t have a business. I am now on day 10 after submitting this Bug report and the tier 2 team acknowledging the bug, with no update on the progress (because there has been none) on the engineering team putting in a fix.

Bubble has real people who are using the platform who have real life responsibilities (I’ve got a wife and 3 kids), who are trying to operate/launch real businesses with real world money at stake. The editor issues/bugs and exasperating bug reporting/resolution system are one in the same. Both need to be addressed, as both have very real impacts on your clients (I’m not a user, I’m a paying client, who pays for a service).

[aj11]

Couldn’t have said it any better.

[IljaIljitsj]

I hope Bubble manages to get these structural issues figured out soon. It’s probably more important than pushing for the next tech-update, judging from the responses of people. But I do want to stress that the Bubble team have built something truly special, and that most/almost all of us wouldn’t have been able to build anything close to what we have now without Bubble. Obviously that doesn’t mean that whatever happens next is a mere bonus, but in the end we’re all cheering for the same team.